• Intersectionality
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  1. #1
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    Intersectionality

    I am not sure how common this is in other places in the world but it seems to be a growing problem with US colleges and their students. They are basically looking at your sex, religion, and/or skin color to determine how valid your opinion is on anything. The more "oppressed" your group identify is, the more your opinion matters. An example of this is that white straight males are believed to be the least oppressed so their thoughts, ideas, and opinions mean the least to these people (if they mean anything at all).

    By definition, intersectionality means - the interconnected nature of social categorizations such as race, class, and gender as they apply to a given individual or group, regarded as creating overlapping and interdependent systems of discrimination or disadvantage.

    This means that people of victimized group identities come together to fight for "the cause" even if the cause they are fighting for does not support them or their specific group. They share the ideas that they are victims too and thus should be supporting each other.

    How do you view intersectionality? Is it a growing problem? Should we just ignore it? Do you see good in this?

    I have no problem with saying I think this victim mindset many people (specially younger adults) have is self-destructive. Grouping a bunch of self-destructive people together seems to cause more bad than good.

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  3. #2
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    I just graduated about 2 years ago, and I can say that I saw this victim mentality cause no less than 5 people i knew personally to sort of give up and expect to have things handed to them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by KorinKitty View Post
    I am not sure how common this is in other places in the world but it seems to be a growing problem with US colleges and their students. They are basically looking at your sex, religion, and/or skin color to determine how valid your opinion is on anything. The more "oppressed" your group identify is, the more your opinion matters. An example of this is that white straight males are believed to be the least oppressed so their thoughts, ideas, and opinions mean the least to these people (if they mean anything at all).

    By definition, intersectionality means - the interconnected nature of social categorizations such as race, class, and gender as they apply to a given individual or group, regarded as creating overlapping and interdependent systems of discrimination or disadvantage.

    This means that people of victimized group identities come together to fight for "the cause" even if the cause they are fighting for does not support them or their specific group. They share the ideas that they are victims too and thus should be supporting each other.

    How do you view intersectionality? Is it a growing problem? Should we just ignore it? Do you see good in this?

    I have no problem with saying I think this victim mindset many people (specially younger adults) have is self-destructive. Grouping a bunch of self-destructive people together seems to cause more bad than good.
    Wow, where do I start? Sit down, KorinKitty (and anyone else), it's time for a little education.

    "They are basically looking at your..." Who's "They" KorinKitty? "...to determine how valid your opinion is on anything. The more "oppressed" your group identity is, the more your opinion matters." Not on literally anything, though...everyone's entitled to an opinion, but just because we all have the RIGHT to have an opinion, an informed opinion outweighs an uninformed one; likewise with how people naturally will place value over someone's own life experiences versus someone who hasn't had (or, in fact, cannot have) those experiences. Do you want a man's opinion on how it feels to be pregnant? Or do you value a woman's more so? How about a woman who has been pregnant? I'm betting you do, we all naturally do: oh, is the straight white male "oppressed" because his opinions on pregnancy aren't as valued as those of mothers'? I'd say no, but if someone wants to be a crybaby about it and say he is, fine, I'm all for them having a safe space to express and work through that. Do you value MY opinion, or that of anyone on this forum, of Outlaw Star more than someone who's never seen it? Who's never heard of it? Thought so.

    Furthermore, this is not what intersectionality as put forth academically means. Though it has been expounded upon (and, from the sound of it, misunderstood by non-academics online, I guess I'm not surprised), it merely means that the neat little social identifiers we have like race and sex are not mutually exclusive from one another, and therefore...you guessed it, intersect. Case in point? Here's a LITERAL case! https://law.justia.com/cases/federal...3/142/1660699/

    This legitimate case, based on legitimate grievances, was knocked down because plaintiffs in a class-action lawsuit "attempted" to identify as both black AND women (because they were), and the court ruled that they could allege that they were being discriminated against because they were black, OR because they were women, but not both (also keep in mind this wasn't the ruling of a trial or anything, this was their decision to keep this out of court in the first place, as in not even up for debate). Doesn't that sound messed up to you? Especially if you're actually experiencing discrimination--systemically, as in not just one person necessarily, nor the same time--because you're black AND because you're a woman in the workforce? (This is the 70s, people.) You're supposed to pick which part of your identity you wholly identify as? Are you black OR a woman? Are you gay OR latino? Are you Christian OR Native American? It sounds ridiculous to say now, today, but that's what people were up against before (primarily) feminist academics articulated this in order to dispel such nonsensical notions that we can now take for granted as sounding nonsensical today.

    So no, dear, it is not a "growing problem" as you seem to want to posit it. It's merely a means of understanding that for ALL of us, things like race, class, religion, sex, sexual orientation, etc., are contributing, non-exclusive factors to our identity and can affect how we are treated. If you want to say, as you delineated, the victim mentality or whatever is a growing problem, fine, that's debatable: but what is not debatable is what intersectionality is, and that ain't it, so I hope I've helped people understand it a bit better.

    Addendum: there comes a point when playing the victim, legitimately or otherwise, is a bad mindset, and one ought to have some help to work through that: "Grouping a bunch of self-destructive people together seems to cause more bad than good." Or, you know, maybe people uniting by shared experiences, even if not all exactly the same (women, minorities, homosexuals, etc.), can be therapeutic? But no, "more bad than good" right?
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    I am not debating what it is, simply saying that I see it doing more harm than good.

    It causes separation. Yes, it is good to come together and speak with people who go through what you do but when you are in a group that preaches and encourages playing the role of a victim, blaming everything bad in their life based on their sex, color of their skin, religion, etc. then it is a problem. You end up with people blaming everything on other people as a whole group. Just because a person of said color shoots another person of said color doesn't make all people of first said color violent, racist, a criminal, etc. but this is the way I see a lot of these groups taking things. Instead of acknowledging the faults of individuals who happen to be a certain sex, color, etc. they group everyone in a "bad category". This only creates more problems with racism, sexism, and the like.

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    Quote Originally Posted by (Who is) Lobo View Post
    Wow, where do I start? Sit down, KorinKitty (and anyone else)
    Errr...nope.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starwind55 View Post
    It deals with a demon virus that transforms people into freaky looking fuckers

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    To be fair, the above analogies are a bit of a straw man. Rather than a specific instance based on some particular topic, KorinKitty is referring to the seclusion of a group because they are that group. Think about how black people may not have been allowed in a café (or various other examples) several decades ago. That discrimination against black people is in the past, but few people bat an eye when white people are discriminated against because we're allegedly the least oppressed, which was the main point of this thread.

    I'm feeling lazy (well, it is gone 3AM here), so I'll put some examples below:













    That's just a handful of videos gathered in five minutes that I likely watched in the past. It's possible they're not all entirely relevant, but one thing's for sure: white people are segregated a lot more nowadays. And I'm not only talking about white people here. It's just that more controversy surrounds them (when the media occasionally decides to report these things anyway) but this problem exists for others too. Liberals have got to acknowledge that this happens. (Although funnily enough, many of those who instigate this are white.) The difference is whether a liberal thinks it's a good thing that white people are excluded from an event for instance. Now imagine if that still happened to black people.
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    I think the problem with intersectionality is that it is a resurrection of the old Marxist doctrine of oppressor vs oppressed; i.e., rather than bourgeoisie vs proletariat, it is now whites vs blacks, straights vs gays, men vs women, etc. Rather than treating people as individuals, this idea pits groups of people against each other based on arbitrary group identities which are invariably derived from otherwise immutable, meaningless characteristics (skin color, sex, sexuality, etc.) This is a major problem because it assumes that all of the members of these arbitrary groups hold the same or similar opinions or ideas. This is simply not true, as all human beings are individuals, and each human being is capable of individual free thought.

    The solution to this conundrum, I would say, is to let go of the idea of group mentalities and group identities, and instead focus on the individual. Treat other people as free individuals equal to oneself, and one is more able to get along with others. Humans are not hive minds, and humans are not slaves to a vaguely-defined identity based on a characteristic that cannot be changed. In fact, I would venture so far as to say that these characteristic should be ignored, because they do not matter in the grand scheme of things. Humans are all individuals, each one with the capacity to make his own life choices and to live how he wishes to live.
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